Black Powder Cartridge Weapons.

Subject: Black Powder Cartridge Weapons.- now your talking ...

I got my first black powder cartridge rifle back in the late '60s early '70s. Decided to buy a good rifle right from the start - a Shiloh Sharps from the old New York address. This was a Shiloh Sharps 1874 Sporter #3 in 40/70 bottleneck cartridge, fancy wood and a really good shooter. In time I started a muzzleloading - buckskinner store and became a dealer for Shiloh. Always had a backorder of guns with customers waiting (biggest problem was supply and demand).  

Ask your questions, if I can't answer I have an old customer that will have the answer...


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Hello,
I am just starting to get into BP cartridges, specifically 45-70. Any pet loads out there? BP is scarce so I’m trying to ration. I’m using a Lee 500 PSP, Lyman 500 and a BACO 540 ( I think) money Bullet mold. Lots of lead. Some Swiss 1.5 and GOEX 2f

I had a Cimarron copy of the 1873 Winchester saddle ring carbine in .44 WCF. I used the Lyman 427666 bullet from wheelweights lubed with Lyman Blackpowder Gold, over 33gr volume Pyrodex P in Winchester brass with CCI large pistol primers.

I later sold it when I was attending truck school to get my CDL. I wish I still had that rifle. I also had a Colt Sheriff's Model revolver chambered in .44 WCF too. That got sold as well, that was a very accurate handgun and it was my EDC for about a year.



Yes, I later realized I miscounted the rounds I put in the magazine.

Buck, That Rifle is a thing of beauty for sure, I hope to own one like it someday

This is my “Armi Sport” 1863 54 cal. Paper cartridge carbine.  
“Almost a BPCG”

This is my son’s Pedersoli 1874 in 45-70, 32” barrel

Recently purchased unfired “Shilo Sharps Big Timber Montana” 1863 sport rifle 54 caliber, 34” half round half octagon barrel.

I have a Uberti 1874 Sharps Rifle in 45-70. With jacketed bullets from 300 to 400 grain in .451 and .452" diameter this gun allows me a best 1.200" grouping at 100. With a good steady younger eye I'm sure it would tighten. But my purpose for this rifle was a good black powder load using the Lee Precision 457-405-F Double Cavity bullet over 62 to 70 grain loads. To date using drop tube loads of Goex FF my best pattern is 9" at 100 yards which is terrible. I'm open for suggestions!

Pedersoli Rolling Block Creedmoor in 45-70 is a rifle I would love to have.
Unfortunately not cost effective for me.

Lewis "Uffda" Leif called me and said you two had a good talk.

He's probably forgot more about black powder cartridge guns than most will ever know. Try and get him on here to share his knowledge on collecting (he has a nice collection of Sharps) and shooting (his duplex loads that really perform if you can stand the recoil).  

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Buck wrote:Lewis "Uffda" Leif called me and said you two had a good talk.

He's probably forgot more about black powder cartridge guns than most will ever know. Try and get him on here to share his knowledge on collecting (he has a nice collection of Sharps) and shooting (his duplex loads that really perform if you can stand the recoil).  

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I had a good visit with him! He is a CHARACTER for sure

OK Buck I copied and pasted this from my post so lets see what you come up with. Hoping you can give some advice:
OK guys what are you loading your 45-70 with? Here's my problem. I just started casting a 500 gr spire point bullet (Lee 90577) for this rifle because it has a better BC over the 405 gr flat nose bullet. (.255 vs. .433).
Anyway when I drop 70 gr of FFg or FFFg down the tube it fills the case up to about 3/8" from the mouth. Then I add a .060" veggie wad to protect the base of the bullet. That leaves me with 1/4" of space for the bullet without compressing the powder. I have to seat my bullet 1/2" for it to chamber into the rifle (max OAL).
Now the bullet will seat to that depth but the seating plug leaves a noticeable ring around the olgive of the bullet which will more than likely affect accuracy.
I'm not sure if I can load this bullet with 60 grs without the same result. Any solutions or should I just stick with smokeless powder? The one below is not my rifle but my model.
1874 Sharps Buffalo Rifle

Bronko22000,

I'll get a guy that can help you, he shoots black powder cartridge guns all the time, does some nice reloads over the years.  When still shooting Buffalo I would take him for back-up.  His name is "Uffda" a freekin' Norwegian from the old country.  I lost count on the Sharp rifles he has many are Wolfgang guns from Big Timber.

I had a friend (passed on) use to shoot in his Shiloh Sharps Roughrider 45-70 - his favorite accurate duplex load was 6 grs of IMR 3031 under 63 grs of 1 Fg Goex and a 500 gr PP bullet.  I tried in my Shiloh Sharps 45-2 7/8 - loaded it with 10 grs of 3031 and 90 grs of 4 FA goex with a 550 PP bullet (one shot was enough for me, never tried that one again). My favorite single shot rifles were the Shiloh Sharps (shown at start of the subject) in 40/70 2-1/10 bottlenecked case and the same caliber in a Ballard by Ron Long when still with Steve Garvey in MT. As I remember (don't count on this with my memory anymore) loaded them with 10 grs of 3031 and 80 grs of 3FFF Goex with a 400 PP bullet (that was a killing machine). I'll call "Uffda" he probably has the loads we used in the 45/70 rifles.  

Did a little looking at my old notes:
My one gun: 40/70 2-1/10 BN Sharps #1 Sporter - cast 403 grain spire point w/ flat base - duplex load; 6/SR4759 - 61/2F - 1 card, 1 lubed wool wad. L.O.C.L 2.060" - 100 yds 5 shot grp. tight grp -excellent

Second gun is a 45/70 2-1/10 Sharps Carbine - cast 2099 grain (Lyman 292 F.N.) flat base - duplex load; 7/SR4759 - 60/2F - 1 card, 1 lubed ox yoke wad. L.O.C.L 2.700" - 100 yds 5 shot grp. tight grp - excellent groups.

Hope this helps ...